To Outlaw a religion?

[johnf]

We can all conceed that the biggest terrorist threat to the world is Muslim fudamentalist. It doesn't matter what party you are in. It's true.

The heart of the Muslim religion and the nation of Islam is that they must spread their religion over the world, which is not unlike Christians. But unlike Christians, their phliosiphy of conversion is simple. Convert, or we will kill you. This is written in their bible, it's not something made up.

So, to be a good true beliver of Islam, you must kill anyone who refuses to convert. This is what terrorism is about. It doesnt' have anything to do will oil, George W., Sadam or Osama. The death of us infadells is their central belief.

So if we allow complete freedom of religion in the US, we give them the right to "convert" all of us to Islam or kill us. That is what thier religion teaches and this is what all "good" muslems want.

Solution- Call it what it is. A Holy war. Outlaw the Muslim religion in the United States.

[TreeStandBowHunter]

[ QUOTE ]
Outlaw the Muslim religion in the United States.

[/ QUOTE ]


HOLY CRAP...YOU GOT MY VOTE. I thought I was the only ignorant minded individual in here. I like this guy. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

There is only one god, the rest of you put your hands where I can see them!!! http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[whitetailkiller]

i agree kinda ...... weather it is in thier religion or not is irrelavent killing(murder) is illegal in this country regardless of why(the only documented exeption to the law is if you kill in self defense --to save your own life) if thier bible says to kill the infidell or non converters then yes it should be band in this country!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ya know we are nice enough to let them into this great country of ours the least they could do is appreciate it and respect us for being kind enough to allow them passage across our borders!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[HuntingInMaine]

I was just having a similar conversation with my dad yesterday! I am really torn about it. America was founded, in part, because people were seeking refuge from religious persecution. If we outlaw a religion, then we are doing just what the founders of our country were running from. On the other hand, we have this religion who wants to kill everyone that isn't one of them. And this is one of the fastest growing religions in the world. God help us!

[johnf]

From the http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif on the post, I meant it as a sad thing. I take the freedom of religion that we have here is an amazing thing. I think if someone wants to bow down and pray to a fire ant mound they have the right to and it's not our place to judge them. But when a religion teaches things thatare so out of ballance with the very law that protects it I think something has to be done, or we face very serious consequences.
There is no compromise for these people. I don't see any way that there can be peace between them and any group or nation that doesn't fall to thier beliefs.

[horst]

In another recent post we discussed making laws solely on religous principals.Now your talking about banning an entire religion from this country.Theres strike 2 for freedom of religion.Next we can deport all the aethiests right?I aint even gonna get into this one http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[Bruce Schmeck]

[ QUOTE ]
America was founded, in part, because people were seeking refuge from religious persecution. If we outlaw a religion, then we are doing just what the founders of our country were running from.

[/ QUOTE ]


While this is correct to a degree, the real problem was that they were having a particular form (denomination) of Christianity imposed upon them.

Strict Islamists are trying to impose that religion on all others and also of those Muslims that do not see the Islamic religion in the same light as they do.

Therefore, I do not believe that the belief that anyone is trying to suppress there religion in that context is true. That is exactly what our forefathers were trying to avoid in the first place.

[johnf]

This is not something I take lightly. Nor do I think the precident would be a good thing for our country and the religious freedoms that we protect. But if there is a group who openly treatens our way of life and their beliefs directly contradict our very existance and the ability to hold our own beliefs what do you do.

They (Muslems around the world) have stated that their religion (not groups or cells) are at war with us. Would we have let Germans come to the United States and practice the Nazi principals during WWII.

I don't think so.

They ( The Muslem nation) are at war with the US. Why then allow them on our soil? It doesn't make sence to me any more.

[johnf]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Next we can deport all the aethiests right?I aint even gonna get into this one



[/ QUOTE ] I aint leaving without a fight!

[/ QUOTE ]

Last time I checked aethiest wern't trying to convert anyone or trying to kill people who believed in God.

It's your right to worship a Cabbage Patch doll, or nothing at all if that's what you want. But, If you're willing to kill me to make me worship (or not worship), then I think something must be done.

[andymansavage]

What about the catholics?? Anyone heard of the inquisitions????

A book was recently published that detailed how to kill GW bush, and nothing was done. Fact is, you can believe what you want, but until you act upon those beliefs, you have done nothing wrong.
I descend from people who were driven out of their homes, raped, tortured, and murdered by the US government not 160 years ago because of their religous beliefs. I thought we were past that kind of thing here. I have more to say, but I have to go.......
Andy

[andymansavage]

They ( The Muslem nation) are at war with the US. Why then allow them on our soil? It doesn't make sence to me any more.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's bullcrap. Don't be so ignorant, you are just perpetuating biased lies. Islamic fundamentalists are the enemy, not any member of the islam faith.

[TreeStandBowHunter]

Buckee, your probably worried about me and this post aren't you http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Don't worry, I will stay out of it...I promise.

[horst]

Awww TSBH, lets hear it from you as well. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Seriously, youve been over there, are all the islamic people in Iraq extremists?Does the whole country feel that if your of a different faith you should be dead?

[ QUOTE ]
They (Muslems around the world) have stated that their religion (not groups or cells) are at war with us. Would we have let Germans come to the United States and practice the Nazi principals during WWII.

I don't think so.

They ( The Muslem nation) are at war with the US. Why then allow them on our soil? It doesn't make sence to me any more.



[/ QUOTE ]

Which muslims stated this, the ones blowing things up and killing people or the other 99% of them that are living peacefully around the world?

yes there are extremists, terrorists who are at war with us.Your talking about throwing a couple million people outta country though who arent at war with us.We fought the germans, japenese, viatnemese, and arent there people from all those countries living peacfully in our country today?I said in a different post i wont hold anyones religion against them and i meant it, I dont care who you pray to.You think they are the only violent religion out there?Look back through history, theres not to many religions that dont have a bloody history of holy wars behind them.You think christianity doesnt have any blood stains on it?Theres probably been more people killed in the name of it then these wacko terrorists could ever hope to achieve, but its the one our country was founded under.If there all such bad people why isnt everyone in here agreeing with the few who say we shouldnt be over there liberating them?When were defending our president against liberals its a good thing we ae over there, but at the same time were gonna run them all outta this country?? http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[buckee]

Hey, there are extremist Christians (self proclaimed) too, who go around blowing up medical clinics and threatening to kill doctors.
I may not agree with other faiths, but outlawing them, because of the extremists amongst them is not the answer.
The David Koresch's, Saddam Hussein's and Jim Jones's of this world will have to be dealt with on
an individual basis. Their followers are just poor blind sheep.

[wtnhunt]

Really could not have said it any better than Steve just did. It is the extremists we need to weed out and get rid of. Outlawing a religion is not the answer.

[johnf]

[ QUOTE ]
What about the catholics?? Anyone heard of the inquisitions????

A book was recently published that detailed how to kill GW bush, and nothing was done. Fact is, you can believe what you want, but until you act upon those beliefs, you have done nothing wrong.
I descend from people who were driven out of their homes, raped, tortured, and murdered by the US government not 160 years ago because of their religous beliefs. I thought we were past that kind of thing here. I have more to say, but I have to go.......
Andy

[/ QUOTE ]

Bust Andy were your people killing others in the name of propigating their own religion. While it was not right, it's not the same thing.

[andymansavage]

Who are mainstream muslims killing?

[johnf]

[ QUOTE ]
Who are mainstream muslims killing?

[/ QUOTE ]

When did I say mainstreem? How many mainstream baptist go out on visitation, how many catholics go to mass every week, how many Jews eat pork, shrip, and smoke.

The bible, nor for what I understand, the hindu, hari crishnas, the budist, Jahovas witnesses, Mormans, nor aethiest text. OK I don't guess the aethiest have a text. But none of them teach that they should go out and kill people who don't agree with them. The Koran does. I have read it. Have you?

I have known several Muslems who are like your average "Christian" in the United States. They are Muslem only by name because that's what their parents were and their grandparents befor them were.
How many times have you been talking to someone and found out after knowing them for some time that they are a very devout Christian, when before you had no idea that they even went to church.
Where do you think terrorist come from? They are very devout Muslems. Many very smart and some obviously with the means to do anything they want or go anywhere they please. Probibly a very small percentage them. But if there was a group of people and 1 out of 10 wanted to put a bullet in your head, would you want to hang out with them? Don't think so.

[johnf]

[ QUOTE ]
Hey, there are extremist Christians (self proclaimed) too, who go around blowing up medical clinics and threatening to kill doctors.
I may not agree with other faiths, but outlawing them, because of the extremists amongst them is not the answer.
The David Koresch's, Saddam Hussein's and Jim Jones's of this world will have to be dealt with on
an individual basis. Their followers are just poor blind sheep.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yet again "bukee" makes the one good point against my arguement. Nice job bukee I like people who think. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[johnf]

[ QUOTE ]


Which muslims stated this,

[/ QUOTE ]

I believe that was the ones slowly cutting peoples heads off with a kitchen knife.

[andymansavage]

Why stop there? we should probably ban all people of middle-eastern descent, after all most of them don't like us. Where did you get your 1 in 10 stat?

Yes, I have read portions of the koran, congrats on finishing the whole thing. I have also read the entire old testament where Jehova commands the children of Isreal to wipe out entire gentile cities. Men, women, children, and even animals slain by the thousands...............

[johnf]

1 in 10 actually comes from the percentage of proclaimed Christians who strive to live under the doctorines of the religion that they claim and what most people would call devout. I figure it is probibly close to the same % for Muslims. I could be wrong.

You know there are some Jews and Christains of midlle eastern decent.

[shotupdeer]

Bad idea. By doing this you only give them further reason to hate the United States. Also, you have to remember that the vast majority of Muslims do not feel the same way about America as the extremists. IMO it would be akin to banning christianity because the ku klux klan burns crosses in people's yards.

[andymansavage]

[ QUOTE ]
Why stop there? we should probably ban all people of middle-eastern descent, after all most of them don't like us.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sarcasm

[johnf]

So then Shotupdeer you equate, flying planes into buildings, cutting peoples heads off, torture, bombing and murder in the name of religion to burning a cross? I can't see the corilation.

The KKK while a vile and depraved group do not do things in the name of any central religion. Probibly because no denomination would claim them. They claim the name of God, but no one religion/denominaiton supports them. The difference with the muslems terrorist is that they are supported not only by their religious leaders, but to a large extent their governments, and leaders. ei. taliban, hamas, plo, for many years entire nations, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Afganistan, Libia.

Would you have advocated letting North Vietnamese communist come to the united states and set up shop in 60's and 70's. Or the Russians in the 60s-90's or the Nazi's in the 40's. I don't think so.

There ideoligy teaches that killing infadells is the right thing. It's even rewarded in heaven. Dieing while killing us gets an even greater reward. Don't you think that's dangerous. What if Mohammid at the 711 finally sees the light and becomes a good little muslem and decides to go out and spread his gospel by blowing up the elementary school down the block all in the name of ala. Or Jameel your friendly dental hygenist decides he wants a bunch of vergins in heaven, so he straps a bomb on himself and goes to the mall. IT HAPPENS. It's just not a risk I'm willing to take.

[shotupdeer]

Congratulations, you missed my point completely. What I was getting at was that you can't ban a religion based on the act of a few bad eggs, so to speak. The ku klux klan considers themselves a christian denomination. The Islamic religion is not a religion of hatred as you would so like to believe. Certain factions of it are, such as the Shiites. You cannot lump all muslims in with the extremists as they are not all the same.

[TreeStandBowHunter]

[ QUOTE ]
What if Mohammid at the 7-11

[/ QUOTE ]

LMAO http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[johnf]

[ QUOTE ]
Congratulations, you missed my point completely. What I was getting at was that you can't ban a religion based on the act of a few bad eggs, so to speak. The ku klux klan considers themselves a christian denomination. The Islamic religion is not a religion of hatred as you would so like to believe. Certain factions of it are, such as the Shiites. You cannot lump all muslims in with the extremists as they are not all the same.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you know what a denomination is? Baptist, Methodist, Lutherine, Penticostal, 4square (ask bukee) ect. I live in the South and have yet to see the church of the KKK on any corners.

The new covanant in the New Testament does not teach anything about hate or killing people because of their beliefs. The Koran does.

There is no old and new testiment in the koran, it's all the same to them. It says to kill people who don't convert. You're just not getting that are you.

[johnf]

Thomas Jefferson was a Christian who fought other Christians so he could worship Christ the way he wanted.

I think if he saw what was going on right now, the constitution would be written differently. And there would be no Muslems here.