Death Pentalty

[TreeStandBowHunter]

Concerning the Tim "Tookey" Williams or whatever his name is out there in CA that is about to get the "Shot" here in a few hours. What do you think about it?

Me personnaly, I ask myself why is he going the easy way and why did it take so long to kill him. It was quoted from one of his supporters "that he is a changed man who writes books leading children away from gang life". Ok but that doesn't change the fact that he killed 4 people in cold blood. I wonder how long if not already it is going to be until famed Jesse Jackson get's involved in this. I say way to go to the CA Gov http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif Sweet dreams http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[jdickey]

We've had lot's of practice here in Texas. Although, California has more people on death row than any other state. Texas is second, but we don't let them stick around too long!

[fisherguy]

he killed thsoe people and started a brutal street gang. He got what he deserves. Yes, he has done a lot of good work while in prison to try to stop the gang violence and help others learn from his mistakes; but it does not change what he did.

[slugshooter]

I agree, maybe he did change his life while in prison, writing books to try and steer kids away from drugs and gangs. But it doesn't take away what he did, let his turnaround be a testimony so others can learn from it while at the same time let others learn that even if you have straightened your life out, you still must pay for your past consequences.

Just to throw another loop in the debate though, if the prisoner were white, same charges and murder record and changed his life around in the same way. Would he get the needle or would he get clemency?

[TreeStandBowHunter]

[ QUOTE ]
Just to throw another loop in the debate though, if the prisoner were white, same charges and murder record and changed his life around in the same way. Would he get the needle or would he get clemency?


[/ QUOTE ]
He would get the needle. It's mostly the black community that makes a big deal about things and involves race and civil rights! I think more blacks get off due to trying not to start riots. They don't worry much about a white guy getting fried, chances are a riot isin't going to start afterwards. But they know if they give the black guy a needle, the Gov is racist, the judge is racist, the jury was racist, the President is racist....should I go on. You asked http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Hey don't get me wrong, the white folks on death row file appeals and ask for clemency as well but it doesn't get the national attention that a black person on death row about to get the needle get's.

[oldksnarc]

When I last watched the news this afternoon, Jesse Jackson was already involved and was comparing Williams to some of history’s truly great people, i.e. ML King, Noah or Moses, and others. The reason it took so long for it to reach the final hour is the “criminal” justice system – their rights are more important than the victim’s or society’s rights. THE REVEREND JACKSON needs to go back to his church and take care of his congregation – oh, wait, he doesn’t have a church. He’s a self-appointed and aggrandized religious leader. Anyone can go on-line to the Universal Life Church and become a reverend or minister.

So, Williams wrote children books?!?! Big deal. Find someone who actually bought one of them or who actually read one. And, because of his writing these books he’s considered for a Noble Prize? KMA It isn’t surprising he changed after going to prison. The first thing criminals do when “caught” is to find God and the error of their ways - it's the rule of Gideon. It’s all show. He’s still not disavowed his wrongdoings or shown remorse for what he did.

Additonally, he hasn’t changed since going to prison. He’s still been a problem to the authorities in prison and still a gang leader there. Writing a book doesn’t equate to turning one’s life around.

Slugshooter, I am totally surprised. I fully expected your response to be a 180. There’s hope for you yet.

Numerous people are put to death by the state every year. All they get is passing mention. The reason this one is getting so media attention is because of the celebrities who have come out in support of Williams - and we know what their support counts for. Several of the black leaders/talking heads I’ve seen on the news talking about this have been in support of his being put to death.

And, whites get the needle more often than blacks – proportionately. Reverse discrimination. 8 of the last 12 executions in California have been whites – while 72% of the serious/violent crimes have been committed by blacks. Although blacks commit more crimes more often, i.e. per capita (and I’m sure this is going to open a whole new argument) - 20-30 years ago most death penalty laws were overturned because of the number of blacks sentenced to death compared to the number of whites. DUH!! If more blacks are committing serious/violent crimes than whites – then it stands to reason more blacks are going to be sentenced to death. But, because of the apparent “disproportionate” number of blacks on death row, death penalties were overturned. Now, the courts are more reluctant to sentence blacks to death than whites for fear of being termed a “racist.”

Bottom line – he's getting his due.

Burn, baby, burn!

[jdickey]

About 12 years ago, a young lady broke into a man's apartment in Houston, her boyfriend tied up the man, and she drove a pick ax into the man's chest.

She received the death penalty. After being in prison for nearly 8 years, and as do many death row inmates, she suddenly became "re-born" and accepted Christ into her life. And miraculously, her life is now changed. As the time came closer to her execution.... the same type hullabaloo surrounded her that is now surrounding Tookie!

All it took was one glimpse of the photograph of that pick ax stuck in the man's chest.... and reality finally hit home.

She was executed..... she was WHITE....!

I don't know if the death sentence acts as a deterrent or not, since there are a minority of states that actually utilize it; it's an issue that can never be decided. California has the death penalty, has the largest number on death row, but I believe this execution will be the first in 7 years!

[Andrea]

He's getting exactly what he deserves.
Everyone is saying how he's changed his life and that he deserves a second chance.

However....when asked by the Feds for more information regarding the infamous gang he started called the "Crips"....he refuses to say anything. He says it would be "snitching".

Now is that the words of a changed man????

Hardly. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Tookie......what a scary nickname. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[slugshooter]

[ QUOTE ]
Slugshooter, I am totally surprised. I fully expected your response to be a 180. There’s hope for you yet.


[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sure you were as were probably a few others on here. I support the death penalty, I believe that if you kill someone you should also be put to death, but I also believe that the death penalty system is inherently flawed. I believe that if there is one innocent person on death row that that is one too many and I also believe that in sentencing someone to death there needs to be undeniable proof, numerous witnesses, video, film etc. Taking another human life is an abhorrent thing, but to take another life without knowing if that person is 100% responsible IMO is worse.

I do not however subscribe to the notion that there are more blacks in jail or prison because they are committing more crimes, it has been proven that blacks receive harsher sentences for the same crimes as whites. If a white man gets probation for a crime, the black almost always goes to jail, but those factors can be different depending on where said crimes were committed.

[oldksnarc]

It's official. He's dead - 12:41 AM FOX News time. There is justice.

[Tominator]

He got off easier than his victims, that's for sure.

I don't believe the death penalty is a deterrent to crime. I don't think it works.

"vengeance is mine, thus sayeth the Lord"

[Nut]

Just think he recieved the President's Call to Service Award in August and this now happened. It had to be the highlight of his year to get that award. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

It took 24 years for this to happen. His death was too easy IMHO.

[TreeStandBowHunter]

[ QUOTE ]


I don't believe the death penalty is a deterrent to crime. I don't think it works.


[/ QUOTE ]

Your exactly right too. It doesn't work because people know that if they are sentenced to death, they have about 20 years to get it overturned.

I think once convicted, they should lead them outside the court house for a hanging. If we would do that, you would have less crime and less money taking from the society for giving them a good home for 20 years. Heck, they live better than alot of poverty sticken families. For what reason?....because they killed someone. Makes you think don't it http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[ QUOTE ]
but I believe this execution will be the first in 7 years!



[/ QUOTE ]

Actually this is CA's 2nd this year http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[preacherman]

I believe that he got what he deserved. Changed man or not, it doesn't change what he did and he needed to pay for his crime. I agree with you guys, it should have been sooner. We could save a lot of taxpayers dollars if you wouldn't let those on death row sit there for 20 years before you carry out the punishment that has been handed down to them. They didn't give the victims of the crime 20 years to think about how they would be murdered. This is just my opinion.

[jdickey]

I couldn't remember if there had been another California execution... they do so few of them!

Like you said, a murderer can kill and sit for 20 years... that's not much of a deterrent! Executions are almost as old as man.... as well as other forms of severe punishment.

The public executions were done away with, because they were too gruesome for people to witness. The electric chair was done away with, because it was too inhumane. With today's media's penchant for the bizzare, it's a wonder that they haven't lobbyed for MORE EXECUTIONS!

[Texan_Til_I_Die]

[ QUOTE ]
...I don't believe the death penalty is a deterrent to crime. I don't think it works.

"vengeance is mine, thus sayeth the Lord"

[/ QUOTE ]

It's an excellent deterrent for the person being executed. In fact, it's the ONLY 100% effective way to guarantee that there will never be another crime committed by that particular criminal.

[Gator]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
. Heck, they live better than alot of poverty sticken families. For what reason?....because they killed someone. Makes you think don't it http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[ QUOTE ]
but I believe this execution will be the first in 7 years!



[/ QUOTE ]

Actually this is CA's 2nd this year http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[/ QUOTE ]


Think prisoners live better than most military when you get down to it, don't they? At least ALOT better than what I did when I was deployed to Bosnia, and probably quite a bit better than those in Iraq.......Now that is TRULY SAD

[oldksnarc]

Tookie died at the Quentin morgue, do dah, do dah
Tookie died at 12:34, oh, do dah day

[oldksnarc]

Took, took, tookie, good bye

[Mathews XT Man]

we got too many sitting on death row..I say "SPEED UP THE FRIGGIN LINE!!"

[Phaseolus (BeanMan)]

You're TERMINATED ******

Line em up and mow em down.

BeanMan

[slugshooter]

I think oldksnarc is a little too happy over this, it's one thing to be for the death penalty, but it's another thing totally to gloat and dance on the mans grave. He has paid his final debt to society. Let it end there.

[wtnhunt]

[ QUOTE ]
Concerning the Tim "Tookey" Williams or whatever his name is out there in CA that is about to get the "Shot" here in a few hours. What do you think about it?


[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
why did it take so long to kill him.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good answer. My thoughts too. The death penalty should be more expeditious. Too bad all states do not use the death penalty and in a more timely manner like Texas does.

[oldksnarc]

Happy to see the system finally work.

[LifeNRA]

[ QUOTE ]
Tookie died at the Quentin morgue, do dah, do dah
Tookie died at 12:34, oh, do dah day


[/ QUOTE ]

LMBO!!!!!!! Yeah he FINALY PAID his debt!!! Only because he KILLED FOUR INNOCENT PEOPLE!!!!!!

[ QUOTE ]
I think oldksnarc is a little too happy over this, it's one thing to be for the death penalty, but it's another thing totally to gloat and dance on the mans grave. He has paid his final debt to society. Let it end there.

[/ QUOTE ]

Juice them all on death row! But then me being catholic and hearing the Vatican saying they were appalled at the execution. Just makes me feel better that I no longer go to there church anymore! EYE FOR AN EYE!!!

[oldksnarc]

[ QUOTE ]
Happy to see the system finally work.

[/ QUOTE ]

I totally support the death penalty and will happily dance on the grave of any murderer, rapist or child molester.

[LifeNRA]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Happy to see the system finally work.

[/ QUOTE ]

I totally support the death penalty and will happily dance on the grave of any murderer, rapist or child molester.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is there room for one more!!! http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[TxAgJeepr]

You'd love Huntsville, TX. The band tunes up on average of once a week. Since I'm out of the area now, It's harder to keep track of the number who have 'paid their debt' but I'm pretty sure it's still about once a week.

[jdickey]

Actually.... it's slowed down considerably! They are doing about 1 per month now!

[oldksnarc]

A dance just once a month? Too quiet.

[TheNumber1Young1]

im glad he got the needle, i look at it this way, If i go out tonight, and rob a bank for a million dollars, and then two weeks later i turn around and give it back,(just like he tried to steer kids away from violence) im still going to suffer the consequences, and so should anyone else no matter what race, sex, or religion you are.

[Yellowhammer]

Should have fried tookie the day after he was convicted. That way the tax payers would have been saved some money. I feel like these people do these crimes to get in jail so they will not have to work for a living and not worry about paying for these high gas prices and such. Three square meals a day heated and cooled cell, weight room, swimming pool, heck if I had all of that I would think that I was on vacation. If they would fry more of these people then I think some of this violence would stop. When or if I have to go to a nursing home, I am going to go out and rob a bank. Why? Because you will be taken better care of in prison than in a home.

[horst]

[ QUOTE ]
When or if I have to go to a nursing home, I am going to go out and rob a bank. Why? Because you will be taken better care of in prison than in a home.


[/ QUOTE ]

prisons free to, going to a home will cost your family everything you have.Aint that a sad reality http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

[Texan_Til_I_Die]

[ QUOTE ]
prisons free to, going to a home will cost your family everything you have.Aint that a sad reality

[/ QUOTE ]

Too true. My mother was in a home for 2 years before she passed away this year. Cost me $4000 a month. But I guess it was money well spent since they took excellent care of her.

[LETMGROW]

Can honestly say I have never thought of this old age strategy. Hmmmmmmmm.

[SaskMan]

He did not deserve the fate he got!!!

He deserved far worse. He spent years living off the system in prison and he mercilessly ended lives, his should have ended in the same manner. An eye for an eye guys!!

[Swamphunter]

Think how many deaths he was at least partially responsible for if you take into account that he was allegedly the co-founder of the crips. Congrats to Arnold for leaving the phone on the hook. Even with all those Hollywood liberals pressing him, he knew the right thing was to put that scumbag in the ground. Too bad the victims familys didn't have the pleasure of doing it for the state.

[Swamphunter]

[ QUOTE ]
It's official. He's dead - 12:41 AM FOX News time. There is justice.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[stevebeilgard]

yea

[BowJoe]

Can I ask you a question there SS? If you don't support the death penalty because of a slight chance of being wrong and executing an innocent man then what is the percentage of overturned death penalty cases in the US? I don't hear of too many making the news these days. George Ryan said the same thing when he granted clemency to 142 people on Illinois' death row right before his reign of scandal ended. In doing so, he allowed Jamie Westray to live on even though he admitted to killing a woman on her 40th birthday by shooting her in the back of the head with a shotgun at close range. I personally knew Westray and he too claimed to be a man of God yet he still destroyed a life all for a simple robbery. He should fry like a chicken at KFC. I like mine extra crispy.

[Chrud]

[ QUOTE ]
I say "SPEED UP THE FRIGGIN LINE!!"

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure wish we would have it in Wisconsin. That clown Vang should be sent right to the front of that line. http://www.realtree.com/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif