NY woodlot help

[Swamphunter]

I am interested in planting something that will grow and attract deer in the fall and early winter. The only problem is that the land I own has no fields what-so-ever, and it is not even feasable to accomplish this as I do not have access to any, nor anyway to cross a creek with machinery to get in there and complete the work. I would like to make my land more deer freindly and had though about planting a few apple trees, back near where the creek bends a bit and there is a small clearing less than 50' X 50'. Any ideas as to what would help get more deer onto my property would be greatly appreciated.

[dogdoc]

i have 60 acres that when I took it over 5 years ago had NO opening--thick hardwoods of various oaks and hickory trees. I ended up hiring a dozer to come in and clear off about 3 acres on the middle of my property--it worked great. The deer now have a hidden food plot on my property plus LOTS of escape cover. However I guess this is something you can't do with the creek where it is.

It is amazing what can be accomplished with a chain saw and some gasoline. just opening up some of the canopy to allow some sunlight to reach the floor will work wonders.

[luckyman4]

This is a MUCH more complicated question than anyone can give a good answer for on here, but I'll try to give it a good start.

When I help landowners with resource planning, my first question is ALWAYS - what is your goal? Your post says that attracting deer in the late fall and winter is your goal. Fall food species - apples, brassicas, oats, etc. are a great way to shoot more deer - they are not a great way to increase the number of deer or make the deer more healthy on their own. Serious habitat management including small clearcuts, controlled burns, travel corridor and bedding area creation, and food plots can take WAY too much time for most people. As you decide what your goal is, think about what you want to provide for your herd vs. how much time and money you are willing to spend on it.

Since I happen to think that just attracting more deer to shoot is a great goal, let's consider the apple trees planted in your open area. Apple trees are pretty hardy and tolerate NY upland soils very well. The most important thing they need to produce good fruit is LIGHT, so a small opening like you describe should be good. You don't plant apple trees close together, so when they get to the adult stage they aren't competing for light. I just did a quick Google search, and it looks like a 12x12 spacing would be ok. That would give you 16 trees in your 50x50 area. The one thing I would caution you about is since this area is near the stream (it actually sounds like a point bar that will flood every spring), watch out for wet soils. Apple trees can tolerate some spring flooding, but they don't want to be wet most of the time. If its wet, think about White Cedar - its a great tree for food and cover for deer late in the hunting season, and it can grow just about anywhere as long as the deer don't overbrowse it.

If you are serious about wanting "Any ideas as to what would help get more deer onto my property," then PM me and maybe we can set something up. I've got about 5000 ideas on how to get more deer onto any property, but I really need to see the property and talk to you.

[QDMAworks4me]

I have one piece of property that I hunt around here that does not have any fields or openings, or any way to get heavy equipment to it. A few years ago we took some chainsaws and some gas and started making an opening where we thought the deer would come to. It is about 150 yards long and 30 feet wide. We call it our sindaro. We have not planted anything on it yet since I just started doing food plots this past year. There was just wild grass growing. I am going to try some of the throw and grow seeds this year and see how they work. I have killed bucks and does on the sindaro but I will tell you the big bucks do not feel comfortable coming out into the openings during the light hours the sindaro when they have all that brush around them to stay hidden in. God luck

[luckyman4]

I've yet to figure out a good way to get a big buck to stand still anywhere he can be seen and shot at.

Is there anything other than grasses growing in the sindaro?? Lots of time by hunting season grasses fall down and don't offer the cover a deer wants for moving through. Are there any woodier browse species in there yet? I've come to the conclusion that pretty much anything with thorns is a good browse species. Sugar maple seedlings and saplings are another one of their favorites. If you could encourage stuff like that to grow, or even plant some, then maybe the bucks would feel more comfortable. Another idea: For natural vegetation near a stand location, one way to make it more attractive than natural vegetation down the road is to spread fertilizer (Triple 10 works for me).

If none of that works, set up a trail cam and make sure Marc and Lynn aren't covering the area with Coyote urine!!

[QDMAworks4me]

[ QUOTE ]
I've yet to figure out a good way to get a big buck to stand still anywhere he can be seen and shot at.

Is there anything other than grasses growing in the sindaro?? Lots of time by hunting season grasses fall down and don't offer the cover a deer wants for moving through. Are there any woodier browse species in there yet? I've come to the conclusion that pretty much anything with thorns is a good browse species. Sugar maple seedlings and saplings are another one of their favorites. If you could encourage stuff like that to grow, or even plant some, then maybe the bucks would feel more comfortable. Another idea: For natural vegetation near a stand location, one way to make it more attractive than natural vegetation down the road is to spread fertilizer (Triple 10 works for me).

If none of that works, set up a trail cam and make sure Marc and Lynn aren't covering the area with Coyote urine!!

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HAHA well this is another peice that we own not the one next to Mark and Lynn, this is another 80 acre piece that we have, they would have to really get wet to come on over to get to my food plot there on that piece.

[luckyman4]

Hmmmm, the last time I was there I saw them both wearing wading boots and they were soaking wet. . .

[PAstringking]

I am having the same problem in northern PA. I am only 22 years old and still considered one of the kids of the family camp. I am not allowd to make changes to the property and i also dont have the money.

i do want to start a management program because i feel that my 120 acres has become a pass through. The deer just arent on my property like they were years in the past.

i can sent you and ariel photo or topo or both. I think that i just need a proposal to present to my uncles and grand father. Any help would be appreciated.

[anderson3]

[ QUOTE ]
but I will tell you the big bucks do not feel comfortable coming out into the openings during the light hours the sindaro when they have all that brush around them to stay hidden in. God luck

[/ QUOTE ]

QDMAw4m,
Your sendero cut is good idea, and adds diversity to your land. But you may not be hunting it quite right. What you have made is a long area where older bucks won't go. That can be a good thing! They will tend to cruise the down-wind side of it. Catch him there.

Be careful of the throw and grow seed mixes with ryegrass in them. It can be a pain to get rid of. Try either a frost seeding this spring, or spray with roundup a time or two and broadcasting a blend of clovers (including some white or ladino) and maybe chicory late summer.

[HaDeRonDa]

Without getting too complicated because your situation must be.
In all honesty, if you are looking for a fruit crop that is viable during the late fall or early winter there are several but you really need to look at your question. Are you asking what to plant that needs little care and that will produce or be of fruit producing size in a short order of time.
I know when early winter is and the hunting season is over by then. Winter starts Dec what?
If you are looking for a great food source that yo ucan cultivate on your own that your family will also benefit from just plant something indigenous to your area such as the blackberry. Keep then all in ROWS and pruned. This can be done with a set of scissor type hand pruners. This will allow you easy picking and the deer easy walking between as they eat, I mean, strip the leaves off of them during the late fall or until the leaves are all gone from being eaten by them. Fertilize to enhance quality of fruit as well as leaves and since your plants will be vibrant and full of vigor then deer will prefer yours to the ones that aren't taken care of next door that grow wild. In an area that size you will be able to pick in a good year 20-40 qts and the deer will be more than willing to stand and pose for a broadside shot in thanks for the wonderful natural grub that you have provided for them. The birds will also thank you as well as the possible bear that you may have near your area.
There are pros and cons to planting apple trees. Bear can wreck young apple trees. Here are some points to consider if apples trees are what you decide to go with. Time to mature, possible spraying, good year vs bad year production of fruit (a late frost can wack them hard) In a bad year, the deer can't eat what is not there as opposed to the blackberry. Deer want your easliy obtainable leaves not the fruit.
Then, your local wonderful buck decides to rub them (unless you wrap them) etc etc.
Raspberries are another easlily cultivated plant that mature and propagate easily. Yummy for your family as well and cheap just like blackberries plants.


Complicated? Not really in my eyes. Things to consider. Sure.

[LETMGROW]

Poor Swamphunter asks a question. Some how, Marc and Lynn get dragged through at least three posts. We asked Rob to keep the waders secret. See how he is?
To help Swamphunter, I would by all means want to open the canopy.Chances are the chainsaw is your best approach. The tops left behind will provide browse this winter as well as encourage regrowth and sunlight. Don't plan on planting massive plots,but plant several smaller areas which can be accesed from different directions to play the wind. I would try to fall trees in a manner where the fallen trees would form a corridor for deer to travel in.
There are some food product seed blends specificaly for shadier areas. I believe Plot Spike has maybe what you are looking for.
PS: I still have that backhoe for sale!

[luckyman4]

[ QUOTE ]
Poor Swamphunter asks a question. Some how, Marc and Lynn get dragged through at least three posts. We asked Rob to keep the waders secret. See how he is?


[/ QUOTE ]

I admit it, I'm just jealous of the "Little Iowa" you've created in your back yard !