Shooting rest help...

**heiner39** · 10-02-2007, 12:06 PM

I just bought a MTM Predator shooting rest for sighting in my new rifle. I've never sighted in a rifle before so I'm looking for some suggestions that might help me get on target. I know about bore sighting and starting close to the target for first shot so I get an idea if I'm on target. I also know about not letting the barrel get too hot while shooting. I guess what I'm looking at is any suggestions on how to shoot with the rest. Do I hold the front stock at all? I know one post I read the poster said he holds his hand on top of the barrel just behind the front rest...is this correct? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

**wtnhunt** · 10-02-2007, 12:27 PM

Use the mtm rest here too, and it helps keep the rifle steady for sure. I try to bore sight initially looking down the bore if the rifle does not have open sights. If the rifle has open sights and they are on, I will use them. That will get you close. As far as how to hold the rifle while in the rest, not too sure what the proper way is, but the mtm rest is not weighted, and the rifle especially if it is a heavy recoiling rifle will try to jump up if you do not hold a hand forward on the rifle. I have tried not holding the rifle I am shooting with the rest and also have tried shooting holding the rifle and not so sure I have noticed a significant difference in my shooting or accuracy either way. I usually will hold my left hand on the barrel or the stock depending on the gun just in front of the scope to hold the rifle steady in place on target while I squeeze the trigger.

**Leo** · 10-03-2007, 12:24 PM

I'm not an expert bench rest shooter, but I have shot with some folks who absolutely are.

So I'll pass on some of the advice they gave me. This isn't as complete a list as the real experts go through but it will definitely get you started shooting much better groups at 100yds. These 10 points will help.

If the rifle has a sling. TAKE IT OFF. Slings and shooting rests do not mix. Resting your rifle on its' sling in a rest is definitely going to effect your consistency. Don't do it.
If your Scope has an adjustable objective. Set it for the distance you are shooting at. Seems like a no brainer but it's easy to forget.
The front rest should be as close to the action front as possible. (ie. under the chambered round) This will keep you from bending the forearm up and therefore putting inconsistent pressure on the barrel. This is true even on firearms with "Free Floated" barrels.
The rear rest should preferably be in front of the stock sling stud. If recoil can slam the stud into the rear rest, you will have issues. On big bags sometimes you can't avoid the stud and get the rifle on target. Better to have the stud resting in the bag than in front. Though this truly is NOT ideal.
Your off hand can rest on top of the scope between the rings for lower recoiling rounds (like 223). That's a good way to do it for the low kick stuff. Just rest your hand there with no added pressure. For the more lively kickers, grip the forearm under the barrel just in front of the front rest, and squeeze the heck out of it.
The rest should naturally point the rifle exactly where you want to hit. If you find yourself pushing the rifle around and trying to hold it on a point adjust the rest some more.
Your cheek weld is an important anchor point. You need to be consistent with this. The best way I've found to do this with a scoped rifle is to get my eye close enough to the rear end of the scope to see that "ghosting" black circle around the outside of your field of view. Back away from the scope until that circle just disappears and is perfectly centered. That will get your cheek weld in almost exactly the same place every time. If you still feel this is uncomfortably close to the scope adjust your eye relief.
Don't mess with variable magnifications while you are sighting in. Turn it all the way up and leave it there until you are confident the scope is on and you are shooting good groups. Only then can you experiment with other magnifications to see if that effects you point of impact. (On some scopes magnification setting does move your POI)
The elbow on your trigger hand should be on the table. This will help immensely to stabilize the rear end of the rifle. What this does is help lock your shoulder in position and keep it from "floating" around. Put a bag or board under that elbow if you need to.
Squeeze the trigger as slowly as you can make yourself do it. This helps keep you from squeezing with the whole trigger hand. Try squeezing with your non-trigger fingers and watch what that does to your point of aim.

Follow all 10 of these tips and you'll shoot better off a rest than most. Even then. It still takes practice to get good. It also takes practice to stay good. Knowing and doing are two different things.

Good luck.

**heiner39** · 10-04-2007, 11:16 PM

Leo, thanks for taking the time to leave that response to my question. It's well thought out answers like that keep me coming back to this site. I think I'm gonna enjoy being a member here!!

**Rinky** · 10-07-2007, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by Leo

I'm not an expert bench rest shooter, but I have shot with some folks who absolutely are.

So I'll pass on some of the advice they gave me. This isn't as complete a list as the real experts go through but it will definitely get you started shooting much better groups at 100yds. These 10 points will help.

If the rifle has a sling. TAKE IT OFF. Slings and shooting rests do not mix. Resting your rifle on its' sling in a rest is definitely going to effect your consistency. Don't do it.
If your Scope has an adjustable objective. Set it for the distance you are shooting at. Seems like a no brainer but it's easy to forget.
The front rest should be as close to the action front as possible. (ie. under the chambered round) This will keep you from bending the forearm up and therefore putting inconsistent pressure on the barrel. This is true even on firearms with "Free Floated" barrels.
The rear rest should preferably be in front of the stock sling stud. If recoil can slam the stud into the rear rest, you will have issues. On big bags sometimes you can't avoid the stud and get the rifle on target. Better to have the stud resting in the bag than in front. Though this truly is NOT ideal.
Your off hand can rest on top of the scope between the rings for lower recoiling rounds (like 223). That's a good way to do it for the low kick stuff. Just rest your hand there with no added pressure. For the more lively kickers, grip the forearm under the barrel just in front of the front rest, and squeeze the heck out of it.
The rest should naturally point the rifle exactly where you want to hit. If you find yourself pushing the rifle around and trying to hold it on a point adjust the rest some more.
Your cheek weld is an important anchor point. You need to be consistent with this. The best way I've found to do this with a scoped rifle is to get my eye close enough to the rear end of the scope to see that "ghosting" black circle around the outside of your field of view. Back away from the scope until that circle just disappears and is perfectly centered. That will get your cheek weld in almost exactly the same place every time. If you still feel this is uncomfortably close to the scope adjust your eye relief.
Don't mess with variable magnifications while you are sighting in. Turn it all the way up and leave it there until you are confident the scope is on and you are shooting good groups. Only then can you experiment with other magnifications to see if that effects you point of impact. (On some scopes magnification setting does move your POI)
The elbow on your trigger hand should be on the table. This will help immensely to stabilize the rear end of the rifle. What this does is help lock your shoulder in position and keep it from "floating" around. Put a bag or board under that elbow if you need to.
Squeeze the trigger as slowly as you can make yourself do it. This helps keep you from squeezing with the whole trigger hand. Try squeezing with your non-trigger fingers and watch what that does to your point of aim.

Follow all 10 of these tips and you'll shoot better off a rest than most. Even then. It still takes practice to get good. It also takes practice to stay good. Knowing and doing are two different things.

Good luck.

Simply Amazing.

**johnf** · 10-07-2007, 09:44 PM

Remember that the point of impact (POI) will change drastically from 25 to 100 yards. If your planning on hunting at or beyond 100 yards don't waste your shells zeroing in at 25. If it is boresigted reasonably, get some of the big targets. I think they are 16 or 18 X 24". You should be able to get on paper with your first set of shots. Take shots in sets of 3-5 to see where the gun is patterning. After one set of shots move the cross-hairs to fix the poi to the center of the target. Most good scope have one click per 1/4 MOA which means for each click the bullet moves 1/4" at 100 yards. If you are 3.5 inches low and 2.25" left you would go 14 clicks up and 9 clicks left. Personally I would go up 23 clicks up because I like to have my guns shooting 1.5-2" high at 100 yards. I do that because most of my guns can ethically kill a deer at 300 yards. If I'm 2" high at 100, I'm right on at 200 and 6" low at 300. Then I know that if I aim toward the top of the kill zone out to 300 yards then I'm going to be eating deer soon.

One other thing. I always hold my breath during the shot. Don't know if you're supposed to, but it seems to help me.

**johnf** · 10-07-2007, 09:49 PM

Remember that the point of impact (POI) will change drastically from 25 to 100 yards. If your planning on hunting at or beyond 100 yards don't waste your shells zeroing in at 25. If it is boresigted reasonably, get some of the big targets. I think they are 16 or 18 X 24". You should be able to get on paper with your first set of shots. Take shots in sets of 3-5 to see where the gun is patterning. After one set of shots move the cross-hairs to fix the poi to the center of the target. Most good scope have one click per 1/4 MOA which means for each click the bullet moves 1/4" at 100 yards. If you are 3.5 inches low and 2.25" left you would go 14 clicks up and 9 clicks left. Personally I would go up 23 clicks up because I like to have my guns shooting 1.5-2" high at 100 yards. I do that because most of my guns can ethically kill a deer at 300 yards. If I'm 2" high at 100, I'm right on at 200 and 6" low at 300. Then I know that if I aim toward the top of the kill zone out to 300 yards then I'm going to be eating deer soon.

One other thing. I always hold my breath during the shot. Don't know if you're supposed to, but it seems to help me.

**Strut10** · 10-07-2007, 10:28 PM

Originally Posted by johnf

Remember that the point of impact (POI) will change drastically from 25 to 100 yards. If your planning on hunting at or beyond 100 yards don't waste your shells zeroing in at 25.

I disagree.

Many times a 25 yard sight-in will eliminate a bunch of downrange guesswork. A good many popular deer rounds, when sighted dead-on at 25 yards, are good to go hunting with about a 225 yard zero. Most popular varminters, 1/4" low at 25 yards are dead-on in the 300 yard area.

Two or 3 shots fired with scope adjustments at 25 yards get you ready to fire your 5-shot groups at 100 yards as soon as you move back. Besides, I'd sooner do the majority of my walking back & forth to the target at 25 steps than 100.

**johnf** · 10-07-2007, 11:06 PM

I'm not sure about the ballistics, but I know every time I've tried to sight one in at 25 and then again at 100, I've used at least 2X's as many shell as I have in just doing it at 100. At $1 a shell I'm going to do the walking.

**Strut10** · 10-07-2007, 11:26 PM

John....

You've just gotta know the ballistics table for the round you're sighting. 1 or 2 tenths of an inch at 25 yards can make a large difference at 100 or 200 yards. I run the numbers on an online ballistics calculator then measure my needed adjustment with a tape measure.

I needed to do a quick sight-in for my .220 Swift last year before a coyote hunt. I had switched scopes and wanted a 300 yard zero. I chrono'ed the load, ran the numbers and sighted in at 25 yards. I then took the target out to 300 yards and the group centered up PERFECTLY and EXACTLY where the ballistics program said it should.

I'll stand by the effectiveness of a proprerly done 25 yard sight-in.